Heb. 11:1: Faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

That's a verse I grew up with and loved. On exChristian there is a discussion on faith and Mythra hit on what I consider to be real faith, though he does not call it that at all. Here is part of his post and my response:



You're absolutely right, Mythra. Way to go! I love that--faith merchants. Unassailable. Peaceful acceptance of reality. No more wildly washing waves of emotion the faith merchants want to stir up. No overwhelming guilt. No overpowering joy. Just peace. Contentment. Life is okay the way things are.

That, my friends, is faith--real faith. That is the faith that will get you through anything life can throw at you--with or without God. Faith is so much more than belief in a deity or the supernatural. The supernatural is nothing but terminology our ancestors used to designate concepts science has long since replaced. As science replaced the supernatural, religion developed. And now people are killed and ostracized for not believing the right things just because. That is not faith--that is crazy! Let's get back to the basics of pure and simple faith. Contentment. Peace.

May I ask, RSM ~ when you speak of 'faith merchants' who want to stir up wild emotions, what kind of person do you mean?

Also, if faith is a peaceful acceptance of reality, in what, or in whom, are you placing your faith?

I ask because I'm interested. I have no ulterior motive.

Thank you for your respectfulness.

"Faith merchants" is Mythra's (another member on that forum) term. I assume he means evangelists or people who want to convert nonChristians to their own faith.

I don't know if anyone agrees with me, religious or otherwise, but I think faith the way I use it in that post is faith or confidence that things will work out in life. When I first started experimenting with the idea of there being no God, the universe seemed so empty. I realized that my very thought structure was programed to accommodate the existence of God. It's a way of thinking, of seeing the world. I decided that is okay; I am too old to change and it doesn't matter. About half a year later I discovered that this has changed. The empty spot is still there but I can now cope with it just fine.

I don't see myself as a child of God anymore. I see myself as part of the universe, like nature and the natural elements and the birds and everything else that exists. This came to me one day during a thunder storm. I was outside taking it all in and it came to me that this is how I "fit in." I have since then read that there are other people who feel this way. I thought that was pantheism, but apparently humanists can feel this way, too. I think perhaps pantheists take it to the level of ritual or some form of religion. I looked into pantheism and it didn't "fit" me.

I don't think anyone or anything is worthy of worship. It's just the way things are. Some things are called trees. Others are called humans. I identify as a human. I am here right now. I will eventually die. Maybe tomorrow. Maybe sooner. Maybe it will be a long time. That is okay. That will be the end. The important thing is that I am happy and true to myself while I am here. When we are true to who we are born to be we naturally live the way all the sages of all the religions--even the wise ones of our own time--tell us to live. If God exists, and if there is an afterlife, God cannot refuse to admit people to heaven. There is no sentient being on earth that would be as cruel as the God that condemns humans to a lake of fire for eternity. That is how I know that that myth cannot possibly be true.

You asked in what my faith is placed. I am not sure. Must there be an object for it? Or is it possible that, like the able-bodied human, we are strong enough to walk on our own? I am thinking of a rather crude analogy. Let's say we live in a time and place where everyone uses walking sticks. It logically follows that if one hand is required to hold onto a walking stick, other means must be devised to carry things. Maybe nobody goes anywhere without a backpack. One person discovers that with a bit of practice he gets along just fine without a walking stick. He can actually balance just fine on his own two legs. This frees up a hand to carry stuff. Which takes a load off his back. Which makes walking easier. Maybe the same applies to faith that we can live life, and that it is okay to die when we can't live anymore.

Does this make sense?

I see I didn't answer the part about stirring wild emotions. Evangelists try to stir people's emotions to get them to feel bad about their sins so they want to convert, or to feel very grateful to Jesus so they will join their church, or whatever. In order to keep people coming and paying the tithe they have to keep stirring people's emotions so they think God is still working in their hearts. At least, so it seems to me. That is what I meant. I feel more peace when it is okay to just be me without any worries about having a right relationship with an imperceptible Being.

To use the style of Hebrews 11:1 and the content of Mytha's post we might say:

Faith is "Acceptance. Not really hopeless resignation, but peaceful acceptance of reality.

I think those who are in this place are unassailable by the faith merchants."