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 Post subject: Legal Status of Atheists
PostPosted: Aug 20, 2007 12:51 pm 
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It seems atheists do not have citizenship status in the USA. Here is a quote from a president, and below that is legislation for various states.

Quote:
Quote:
(Euthyphro's Thorn @ Aug 19 2007, 11:41 PM) *
"I don't know that atheists should be considered as citizens, nor should they be considered as patriots. This is one nation under God."
-- George W. Bush



Actually, I think the elder Bush said this in 1987 while still a candidate, not the current president. Regardless, it's pretty amazing that a president would say something like this.

Originally posted here by Beowulf.


Occasionally this concept arises on exChristian. At one point I saw a website that listed the states and legislation that say atheists don't count as citizens in the US. Unfortunately I didn't keep it. Later I found this one. It's a satirical site. However, I assume this bit of legislation is accurate. Scroll down to: Do Atheists Have Equal Rights? Do They Deserve Them?

According to that bit, atheists are legally denied to hold government office in the following states:

Arkansas

"No person who denies the being of a God shall hold any office in the civil departments of this State, nor be competent to testify as a witness in any court."
article 19, sect. 1 of the 1874 constitution

Maryland

"That as it is the duty of every man to worship God in such manner as he thinks most acceptable to Him, all persons are equally entitled to protection in their religious liberty... nor shall any person, otherwise competent, be deemed incompetent as a witness, or juror, on account of his religious belief; provided, he believes in the existence of God, and that under His dispensation such person will be held morally accountable for his acts, and be rewarded or punished therefore either in this world or in the world to come." Bill of Rights: Article 36

Massachusetts

"As the happiness of a people, and the good order and preservation of civil government, essentially depend upon piety, religion and morality; and as these cannot be generally diffused through a community, but by the institution of the public worship of God, and of public instructions in piety, religion and morality: herefore, to promote their happiness and to secure the good order and preservation of their government, the people of this commonwealth have a right to invest their legislature with power to authorize and require, and the legislature shall, from time to time, authorize and require, the several towns, parishes, precincts, and other bodies politic, or religious societies, to make suitable provision, at their own expense, for the institution of the public worship of God, and for the support and maintenance of public Protestant teachers of piety, religion and morality, in all cases where such provision shall not be made voluntarily." Declaration of Rights: Article III

North Carolina

"The following persons shall be disqualified for office: First, any person who shall deny the being of Almighty God...." Constitution Article 6 Section 8

Pennsylvania

"No person who acknowledges the being of God and a future state of rewards and punishments shall, on account of his religious sentiments, be disqualified to hold any office or place of trust or profit under this Commonwealth".
Declaration of Rights Article 1 Section 4

Tennessee

"No person who denies the being of God, or a future state of rewards and punishments, shall hold any office in the civil department of this state."
Bill of Rights: Article 9 Section 4

Texas

"No religious test shall ever be required as a qualification to any office, or public trust, in this State; nor shall any one be excluded from holding office on account of his religious sentiments, provided he acknowledge the existence of a Supreme Being."

Article 1 - Bill of Rights: Section 4

[align=center]*********[/align]

Does anyone know--do Canada and other lands of former Christendom like the UK, other Western European countries, and Australia have similar legislation hidden away somewhere in the bowels of their constitutions???

If so, what are the implications? Could it be used against us depending who got their hands on it and depending what crazy ideas pervaded their brains?

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P.S. I do my own thinking.
visit our Website
Website includes resources for deconversion & links to secular groups.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: May 31, 2008 5:56 pm 
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Location: Ontario
This post is not exactly about the legal status of atheists but their social status and about social prejudice against atheists. Legal status and social status are closely related. If we were socially accepted, legal acceptance would automatically follow.

Austin Cline, an American, wrote a some good articles.


He explains how "religion and theism force atheists into the closet," and that the danger of coming out is the same as for homosexuals. He asks the question so many exChristians ask themselves: Does staying in the closet make a person a hypocrite?

Austin Cline wrote:
Perhaps, but it is a very hard person who would suggest that the truth be told in all cases, even when it results in unnecessary emotional and psychological anguish. Sometimes perhaps it is better to leave well enough alone and keep quiet.


He then raises another concern so prominent among exChristians: How will this reflect on atheism? He replies that it is not so much a reflection on atheism itself as on the intolerance Americans have for atheism. In his words: [I]t really isn't a reflection on atheism itself that so many people in America have trouble accepting a relative who is an atheist.

That is the underlying problem. People--especially Christians, and not only in the US--have a problem tolerating atheists. He goes on to show how this makes certain topics of conversation impossible. Over the long haul, the relationship can die for want of discussion of deeply important topics.

What Cline does not say is that Christians will then blame the atheist for causing the relationship to die. While I was still deep within the fold I would hear such comments as "Things started to change when he left the faith. He never talked anymore. We seldom heard from him and when we did hear he just talked superficial stuff like the weather. He drifted away from us. Today we're not even sure where he's living."

When I left the fold I learned about the other side of the story--the side that the family never tells--the severe persecution, the hatred and anger that is expressed, the abuse and threats of hell that permeate every conversation. At a time when one feels oneself to be in a cosmic life and death struggle between good and evil itself, all of one's family and friends jump on oneself stabbing and pounding with all their might as though attacking the devil himself. Is it any wonder that one withdraws at that point, locks the door, and refuses to answer the telephone, blocks emails, and returns mail and gifts?

Naturally, the change occurred at the time of the person's deconversion. But the deconversion was not the cause of it; Christian intolerance was. Christians think the atheist brought it on by choosing to deconvert. Christians refuse to listen to the reasons behind the deconversion; they do not try to understand. They only blame and accuse and attack. At best, they tolerate with indifference. They do not warmly embrace the decision as having been the best for the individual. Nor do the discuss the pros and cons in neutral philosophical debate so that the individual can better weigh the pros and cons. No, not at all. All such activity is considered taboo by the Christian mindset.

When the Christian community turns en mass upon a single human individual, that individual must do what is necessary to survive. What former friends and family members think must, for the individual's own mental well-being, be blocked from mental awareness. When and if contact is re-established with the family, it must be of the most superficial quality.

More Articles by Austin Cline


_________________
~RSM
P.S. I do my own thinking.
visit our Website
Website includes resources for deconversion & links to secular groups.


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 Post subject: YouTube on Famous Fools
PostPosted: Jul 15, 2008 12:59 am 
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Joined: May 09, 2007 1:53 pm
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[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdVucvo-kDU[/youtube] Click Here

_________________
~RSM
P.S. I do my own thinking.
visit our Website
Website includes resources for deconversion & links to secular groups.


Last edited by RSM on Sep 21, 2009 8:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Add live link


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Oct 20, 2008 2:00 am 
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Joined: May 09, 2007 1:53 pm
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Location: Ontario
I found the original article in which George Bush, Sr. stated that atheists should not be considered citizens or patriots. Apparently, there was far more to it than a single occurrence of failing to say the politically correct thing, as I had suspected the case to have been. He had been given ample opportunity to retract his statement, and later to apologize. Though the article was written in 1992, it seems the original offense occurred in 1987 and has not yet been corrected. It continues to come up in discussions to this very day. The article is here.

_________________
~RSM
P.S. I do my own thinking.
visit our Website
Website includes resources for deconversion & links to secular groups.


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 Post subject: Re: Legal Status of Atheists
PostPosted: Sep 21, 2009 8:27 pm 
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Joined: May 09, 2007 1:53 pm
Posts: 921
Location: Ontario
VIDEO: Unelectable Atheists

This video begins with:

    A country that boasts about religious freedom has eight states that do not allow atheists to hold public office.

_________________
~RSM
P.S. I do my own thinking.
visit our Website
Website includes resources for deconversion & links to secular groups.


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