Originally posted Aug. 11 on the New Forums.

"Faith is not logical/reasonable." "Faith does not make sense." I have heard these arguments so often I just want to ram someone's head into a concrete wall.

That argument lets them off the hook! They don't have to confront the difficult questions. They can relegate it all to faith. And they love preaching the virtues of a faith that does not make logical sense.

Does the faith make emotional sense? Not when we see people being kicked out of churches and homes because of their sexual orientation or personal convictions about God. The nonreligious person's conviction that the existence/nonexistence of God is not important is a conviction about God.

Does faith make ethical sense? Not if we look at all the honest, caring, law-abiding people that God and Jesus and the Holy Spirit (Trinity) want killed or damned.

Why do some decent, caring, honest, law-abiding citizens preach that belief in the shed blood of Christ is important? If the faith makes no sense emotionally, logically, or ethically, why does anyone hold onto religious faith?

Originally posted by Ex-COG



Because they believe in it, thinking that they gain something from that belief. The power of belief can overrule evidence and logic. Only when the shell of belief has been cracked through repeated disappointments, nagging questions, recognizing the rewards of other beliefs are better, etc. will one pry themselves out of an unhealthy system.

What exactly is the "power of belief"? What would be the normal everyday or psychological term for it? Where does it come from? Are people born with it?

The power of belief probably comes from some type of brain function. It seems to be wired into us. Religions and superstitions exist in all societies; skeptics are the unusual ones. This is probably why some people hang onto beliefs even when they have questioned them and recognize the nonsense within their religious system. There is still a need to believe. I guess I doubt whether the human race is as rational as some think it is.

The evidence certainly abounds to support your position. I think that is a big reason why education has such limited effects on improving society. When we look at the human race as a whole, it seems gut-level experience is the only thing that really has any impact at all. For example, it took the extreme case of the holocaust in the mid-20th century to convince religious Western intellectuals--the people with the world's best education--that perhaps anti-semetism is morally wrong. Education in and of itself was totally incapable of teaching these people a thing. From this perspective, I guess the uneducated fundies do have a point: there are things that are not learned from books-